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14 Apr 2021 23:39:50
Just seen a stat at work, that villa are in bottom 6 for giving under21s game time, that's not good when we have a probably about 8 that should be 15/ 20 minutes a game that wouldn't do any harm, I'm a big believer in youth and I think Barry, chuckwere, kessler, biddance, revan, should be on bench at least, we don't want our youngsters poached off us then come back to haunt us because our managers too stubborn or scared too play them, personally I'd throw them in with the 1st team squad and let them grow and give them 15/ 20 minutes but that's just my opinion it could save us millions, we need a winger and striker in summer we have Barry, and biddance why not give them a chance 1st b4 spending big let's produce our own wonderkids, then sign proven prem player or euro players.

Agree0 Disagree0

15 Apr 2021 08:36:13
With Trez now out for the remainder of the season, and Barkley seemingly a lost cause, I would hope to see their places on the bench taken by some of the names you mention 4eva. The same could apply to players like Elmo and El Ghazi if they’re not in the plans for next season, then try a few youngsters who could be.
Some of us have been banging on about this for weeks now, and I’m glad to see you’re in that camp.
Deano does seem to have his favourites but they’ve not exactly been cutting it of late, and now is the perfect time to see what some of those lads are capable of producing on the big stage.

15 Apr 2021 08:45:15
I think we need to be careful with this crop of young stars, we have an opportunity to really cultivate a future Aston Villa side but (for me) the should not be rushed - The kids looks excellent but the majority of them are 16 or 17, we can easily forget that as they play U23s every week but they are kids - And yes I know Jude Bellingham is playing CL football at 17 and Michael Owen was ripping the WC a new one at not much older but these are the exceptions, not the rule. We need to ensure these kids are integrated into the first team at the right time, and (again for me) now is not the right time. Yes we have nothing to play for but this is the men's game and introducing these lads before they are ready could be detrimental to their development - For me a summer of strengt and conditioning and a season long loan would be a much better approach. Just my opinion though :-)

15 Apr 2021 10:39:33
What would you rather have? A raw, talented kid who'd bust his b###s off trying to impress and make a name and career for himself? Or an experienced PL/ CL/ International who throws his hands in the air and drags his feet around like Kevin the teenager? I know which i'd chose any day of the week. Its time we threw off this theory that you have to protect the youth. If they're good enough they'll shine.

15 Apr 2021 11:49:45
I honestly would not take any notice of this stat, although it's come from CIES Football Observatory (brilliant for stats) you have to take into consideration the current climate we have been
thrown into for the past two seasons.

C.V. has impacted if not all the premier teams where 1st team players (or whole squads) were forced to isolate and as a result they had to rely on the U21's to play in there place.

The stat is based upon game time from the last 30 games. Ours is 1.4% of game time for 29 games.
Top 5 are Wolves (16%), Sheff Utd (12.4%), Arsenal (11.3%), Dirty Leeds (8.7%) and Man City (7.8%)
Man Utd recorded 4.7% as did WBA, with Spurs, Palace and Fulham not giving game time to any under 21's.

Spain, France, Italy and Germany: Barcelona 15%, Monaco 14%, Verona 11.7% and Borussia Dortmund (28.5%) thanks to Bellingham, Reyna, Haaland and Sancho all under 21 prior to 30 March.

To see the states go to Football Observatory website and click the Best clubs for young players: global rankings.

15 Apr 2021 13:16:20
Totally agree 4eva, fed up of saying it to be honest.
BK, sorry mate but when have Villa been noted for rushing youngsters through, we never have mate, as 4eva has said we are in the bottom 6.
When is the right time as you say? and a mans game you call it, you can die for your country younger than some of these kids.
People can say what they like but some of them are ready for first team minutes, and need exposure.
We are not asking them to save us from relegation, just to give us an idea of their progress, and whether they can save us some money.

15 Apr 2021 13:21:43
Moose, we don't know if they are good enough yet, yes I would prefer Aaron Ramsey bursting his a$$ instead of Ross Barkley but at what cost? We absolutely have to protect these young players, Aston Villa are in a great position but just because the ran riot against Burton U18s doesn't mean they are ready for Man City next week.

The likelihood is that we will see Barry, Kessler, Ramsey, Chukwuemeka and Philogene-Bidace migrating to the senior squad over the next few seasons and I'm 100% convinced (like you) they will be fantastic players for Aston Villa but the fact is, for every Bellingham or Owen there are 20 young players thrown in at the deep end who can't handle it and don't fulfill their potential. We should nurture these players, remain patient, perhaps consider some loans to give them experience of the men's game without lining up against Kevin DeBryune.

15 Apr 2021 14:00:30
Dave, I'm not saying they shouldn't get experience of senior football, I'm saying there needs to be a strategic plan to get them there - Throwing Chukwuemeka into the team against Premier League midfielders could destroy his confidence. 3 months strenght and conditioning over the summer and a loan to League 1 next season where he will be a Rolls Royce player (like Jack a few years) is a much better option for Villa long term. He comes back confidence intact with experience of the senior game and ready for the Villa team.

The reality is we (football fans) are a fickle lot (me included), one moment a player is flavour of the month and after a few bad performances he should never play for us again - The club will be aware of this, and aware of the fact we have the foundations of a very good team in 4 or 5 years from the academy, these players will not be rushed.

15 Apr 2021 14:08:42
That’s the beauty of the situation now Dave, there’s no real pressure, and I sense a growing number of Villa supporters are curious to see how they would do.
Did anybody really know if the likes of Owen, Rooney, Giggs, Foden etc. we’re going to be exceptional before they got their debuts at the age of 17. The point being nobody knows until they’re given the stage to perform on.
What greater motivation for any young footballer is there than to get a taste of first team football. Give them a taste of it now and they’ll be hungry for more.

15 Apr 2021 14:23:04
Absolutely Mark, 100% mate.
BK, pussy footing around assuming that game time against a quality midfielder, is going to destroy someones confidence is not on mate.
If it does, they are in the wrong business.
And yes we are fickle, some of us 😂 so we will have to agree to disagree on this, sorry but nobody will convince me otherwise, on this topic.
There will never be a better opportunity, than the current situation.

15 Apr 2021 14:48:25
I'm happy to agree to disagree on this one as you won't convince me that throwing youngsters in for the sake of it will benefit them, gradual introduction is what is required and I assume (hope) the club feels the same way.

15 Apr 2021 15:03:04
Hang on a bit BK, let's get this right, gradual introduction is what I am on about.
I have said game minutes, not throw them into full games.
So you agree with me now?

15 Apr 2021 15:26:58
Last 15 -20 minutes of games is gradual introduction isn’t it 🤷🏼.

15 Apr 2021 15:36:02
Exactly Mark.

15 Apr 2021 16:02:39
Yup, that's what I'm on about too 👍.

15 Apr 2021 16:53:32
I think the other benefit you get from introducing youngsters to first team action is it shows the next generation that if you are good enough a clear path to first team football is available to you, what we don’t want is what’s happened at other club’s where talented youngsters have felt they have little or no opportunities and therefore come contract time they seek pastures new. With our investment in youth we want that to benefit our club not someone else’s.

15 Apr 2021 17:02:32
Gradual introduction over the coming seasons is what I meant, rather than minutes this season - I don't think we will agree on this one lads 😀.

15 Apr 2021 17:39:29
If you're old enough, you're good enough- just ask Ron Benson and Trevor Hedges 🤣🤣🤣🤣.

15 Apr 2021 18:32:45
They beat Burton U18s 9-0 but that's the equivalent of the first team playing Sutton Utd.
For every good result they've had a shocking one. They are outside the playoff places of the second division meaning they aren't playing the top youth teams and are still struggling to be at the top.
There's an argument for the top youngsters being better around better players but people are suggesting over half that team are first team ready. If that was the case they should easily be winning that league.

15 Apr 2021 19:02:19
Villa nearly got relegated last season, but still possessed one of the best midfielders in England.
Your point proves nothing rk.

15 Apr 2021 19:04:39
I played in the same team as a lad that went to Lilleshall (we’re talking 30+ years ago) a centre half, he was Jaap Stam good at 14/ 15, the nose signed him and then he went to Derby when they were throwing money around, pretty sure they paid bout half a million for him and he hadn’t even played a 1st team game, think he played about 10 games for Derby then never heard of him again, think he ended up at Forest Green. I think my point here is there’s a very fine line where a player could go either way, this guy was immense as a kid, surprised he didn’t make it big time, he weren’t a Billy Big B@ll@cks either, can only put it down to miss management 🤷🏼‍♂️


15 Apr 2021 22:19:27
1 player isn't 6 like we're talking about is it? I can understand picking out 1 and saying he stands out but when people claim half a team are ready despite not having achieved much at a much lower level then there is definitely a point.
There is a lot of promise there that we have been shown glimpses of but they still need to learn what it takes to get results.
Promotion to youth division 1, loan time or at least a result in the "whatever the JPT is now called" cup stakes their claim. It's a great future but the level is still far removed from Prem football at this moment in time. Players like Vardy and Kane had to get experience at lower levels to get where they are. In contrast you look at Liverpool having to throw in youngsters who haven't been a disaster but have certainly dropped them a level or 2. It's probably cost them Champions League football. If we drop a level or 2 then we're in trouble.
Give them loans at teams competing near the top of Championship or League One (wherever they can get ample game time) so they get the chance to show their worth in a team that isn't struggling. Builds up confidence and experience before being thrown into our melting pot of expectation.

16 Apr 2021 12:37:11
I don’t think it would be a melting pot of expectation between now and the end of the season though.
I see your point regarding a mixed season in the u23 league rk, but even if there are 4 or 5 outstanding players if the rest aren’t up to scratch, that will be reflected in the results and league position. There are 5 players, Barry, Chukwuemeka, Ramsey (A), Philogene Bidace and Hayden, who have been consistently outstanding throughout this season. They haven’t always been available as a group for the matches though, which will have an influence on the results.
By all accounts the Leeds team which sits on top of the table has much greater strength in depth and isn’t necessarily a team containing outstanding individuals.
It will certainly be interesting tonight when our lads face Leeds as all 5 mentioned above should be available to play.
It may well be the case that all 5 aren’t ready for regular first team exposure, but one or two of them might be.
There really is only one way to find out and that’s to give them the opportunity. Europe hopes have been extinguished, risk of relegation is no longer an issue, and there are no supporters to express their displeasure, therefore the pressure is as minimal as it’s going to get.
If ever there was a good time to give them their baptisms it’s surely now.
Other clubs would also be very interested to see how they fare, and not only would it give them ideal preparation for loan deals next season, but it could mean they’re loaned out to better clubs. It would put them in the shop window if you like.
I have to say this topic has generated a lot of debate and opinion appears to be very much divided. No doubt the debate will continue after tonight’s game against Leeds.

16 Apr 2021 12:56:43
I don’t suppose you could move this post could you Ed.
I didn’t realize VillaDave was going to start a new thread on the same topic. If it could be moved to just under rk’s post at 12: 31: 59, it would be very much appreciated.

{Ed002's Note - That is not possible. Just repost it Mark.}

16 Apr 2021 13:19:03
Short of writing it out all again, I don’t know how to do that Ed.
No worries mate, it doesn’t matter.

{Ed002's Note - Cut and paste it.}

17 Apr 2021 11:50:43
Sorry Ed, forgot to say thanks 👍.



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